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Britain’s ‘brown babies’

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Lucy Bland discusses the history of the estimated 2,000 babies born to black GIs and white British women in the second world war.

Image courtesy of interviewee. February 2, 2024

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The speaker discusses their experience watching a program called "Mixed Britannia," which explores the mixed-race demographic of Britain throughout the 20th century. They became particularly interested in the stories of children born to black GIs and white British women during and after World War II, which led them to research and interview these individuals, finding a significantly larger number than the estimated 2000. The speaker highlights the historical context, including the term "brown babies" used by the African American press to refer to these children, and describes the racial dynamics surrounding black GIs in Britain.

The talk addresses the discriminatory policies that barred these soldiers from marrying without permission from white commanding officers, which was typically denied due to prevailing racist attitudes. The speaker recounts the difficulties faced by mixed-race children, including societal rejection, lack of representation, and the struggles of their mothers, some of whom were ostracized by their families. They also mention the social environment of wartime Britain, characterized by segregation and tensions between white and black individuals.

Throughout the speaker's efforts to collect stories, they find that many of the mixed-race children faced an identity struggle in predominantly white areas, often feeling isolated or unaware of their racial differences until later in life. The speaker aims to raise awareness of this overlooked aspect of British history, emphasizing the importance of sharing these narratives to foster connection among those with similar backgrounds and to educate the wider public on this complex historical issue. They note the contemporary relevance of these stories, as people are still discovering their roots through modern DNA testing and community building initiatives.

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X-TIMESTAMP-MAP:LOCAL=00:00:00.000,MPEGTS=900000

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I was watching a program called Mixed Britannia,

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which is about the, the whole, the,

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the mixed race nature of Britain through the 20th century.

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And I was watching the second,

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I'd actually been involved a little bit in the first

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episode, but the second episode opened with the,

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presenter, George Alleg going off to meet

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his brother-in-Law, who was, someone born to

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a black gi and a white British woman had been given

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up to Bernardos.

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And then there's another person in the home also had gone

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to, sorry, in the program

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and also gone to a children's home.

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And I thought, this is so fascinating.

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I didn't know about these children at all.

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And at the time, I was working on something else,

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I was working on, women in the 1920s.

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So I thought, I'll go back to this

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and see if anyone has written about this.

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And, you know,

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and I went back in two years later, 2013, there was very,

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very little written, and I thought it'd be great

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to actually talk to these people themselves.

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It was estimated about 2000.

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And so I went on the radio, I put adverts in local papers,

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various ways of, of trying to find people.

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And it all snowballed.

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And then I, I started the interviews

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and it absolutely fascinating.

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And still people are coming forward.

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I mean, I think there were more than two, 2000 actually.

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I think there were more than two thou. It's just,

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there seems to be so many,

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and the, the story, there's so little known

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that these children were born.

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I just think it's, it's a part of, British history,

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a part of the history of the war

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that people just don't generally know about.

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So the term brown baby sounds a bit strange,

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but it's the term coined by the African American press.

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Uh, just after the war,

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I think it was the Pittsburgh Courier, which was a leading,

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black American newspaper,

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and they called them the brown babies in this country.

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They were called half Cast,

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which is a really unpleasant term,

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or they were called colored.

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But brown babies was the term

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that the African American press used.

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And a lot

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of the people I've interviewed actually like the term

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as a way of describing a particular grouping of,

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of, of that time.

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And it wasn't of course, just in Britain

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because Americans, you know, went all over the place.

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But after the war when they occupied Germany

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and Austria, there were children born there to black gis.

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And a number of them actually were adopted in the States,

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and they were known as brown babies.

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So that term,

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really took off from the African American press.

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The black gis weren't allowed to marry

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because they, every, every GI had to get permission

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to marry from their commanding officer.

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And invariably, the commanding officers were white.

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And again, invariably they would refuse.

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And if they were pressed for a reason,

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They'd say, well, back in the States were then 40 states

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of those 30 had anti miscegenation laws.

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Laws that forbade marriage between whites and blacks.

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So all the southern states.

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And it's estimated that 75% of the gis, white

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and black came from the south.

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So, you know, if they'd gone back.

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And in fact, I know of a case

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where a woman did go over in 1947,

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and married her black gi

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and she was then deported and he was in prison.

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So that was a southern state. So it was just not allowed.

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And you might know that, you know,

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those anti assassination laws carried on right up

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until 1967 when at a federal level they were overturned.

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But there still were 16 states that had these laws.

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First of all, as I was saying, I try to

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find people to interview.

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So, I went on something called Gira,

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which is a self-help organization

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that helps people trace their GI families.

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Um, I went on radio, local radio, national radio,

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some women's art, et cetera.

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And, I also went to various archives.

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So I went to the archives all over the place.

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So I mean, obviously the National Archives

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with Auto Archives in Somerset.

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And there, I mean, there were various archives

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to find out about the various children's homes

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to find out about, any other information.

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So about, about, about the children

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and about attitudes towards the black gi.

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So the National Archives has a lot on that.

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I mean, very racist attitudes.

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The, British War Cabinet didn't want any black GIS

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to come over a tour.

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Um, but the thing is,

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Roosevelt had made a deal with the black leaders in 1940.

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He got reelected in 1940,

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and he, he, said that he, he agreed to

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the military to represent the percentage of

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black Americans in the country, which is 10%.

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So he did say that anywhere they went in the theater of war,

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they should be up to, you know, about 10% of them,

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should be, black gis.

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And of course, it was a segregated army.

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It went on being segregated officially to 1948.

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But actually, apparently it carried on even in the Korea

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war, there was that segregation.

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So, that's why they did come.

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And, and, you know, they, they came, they joined

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after Pearl Harbor in December 41,

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and they started arriving in January 42.

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And there's all this, comings

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and goings between the war cam

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and, people in the states saying, look, if you can't,

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stop and coming, you know, they then talked about,

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we want to make sure they don't have any contact

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with white British women.

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And, so, Morrison

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Home secretary says, you know, it would be a great,

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it'll be a great problem if we have a, a whole growth

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of half cast children.

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So there's this notion that Britain is fundamentally white

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and we don't really want these people here.

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We got to come, we got to keep them away.

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And there are these directives of written about how,

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women should have as little to do,

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with the black jazz as possible.

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These are handed out to, the women in the Army,

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but there is that general kind of disapproval.

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But of course, actually, you know,

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women on the whole take no notice of this.

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And there are these dances that get set up.

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Um, some nights are called white dances.

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Some are called black dances

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because there is this anxiety that,

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the white gis are going to be very hostile

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as they indeed were to seeing black gis with white women.

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And in fact, I mean, they were so abusive

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and they did the most terrible things.

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And I, I mean, I, there's, there's definitely evidence

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that kind of lynched men

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and, you know, horrendous stuff that got covered up.

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But to try and minimize this, a lot of villages

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and towns were designated for blacks only,

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or they just give the name of,

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of the actual unit one one day, and one evening, and,

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and whites the next, and similarly pubs.

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So you had that segregation,

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and for dances, you'd have the black dancers where,

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you know, women could meet the black gis.

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Um, and indeed they would have pubs

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where they could go and meet them.

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So they, they did meet them.

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Um, although they, you know, often had a lot

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of hostility from the white eyes.

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The women were spat out as well as the black eyes being,

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being, abused.

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Um, but you know, they were, they were seen as attractive.

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They were kind of seen exotic.

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Many people hadn't seen many black people

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unless you lived in the port of Liverpool, a very, or,

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or Cardiff or Bristol.

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I mean, it was, it was a, a very, very white country. Then.

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There was only about eight to 10,000, people

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of color across the whole country.

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Um, but also they often ha came

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with new dances, Lindy Hop, et cetera.

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Um, and music, they often came with jazz bands.

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And, you know, women loved dancing.

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This was like the biggest leisure pursuit

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for women across class, dancing

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and going to the pictures, which was cheap then.

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And so, you know, it, they, this is seen as very attractive.

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Here were these men who you hadn't seen that name before,

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but also they, they were, knew how to dance.

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They had this amazing music.

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So inevitably relationships formed.

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And inevitably also babies appeared

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because, you know, I don't think any birth control was used.

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I know that GIS would've been handed

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condoms, but did they use them?

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I doubt it. And you know, people lived had this idea

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that you dunno what's gonna happen tomorrow.

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You have to live for the moment.

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And so I think that was the last thing on their minds.

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Really, nearly half of these children, well,

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No, just over half of the children were kept

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by mothers or grandmothers.

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Sometimes it was grandmothers

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and the mothers aren't quite young.

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And you know, the grandmother felt, well, I'll step in the,

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and the others, it's pro,

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approximately about 50 50 were put in children's homes.

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So those that were kept by mothers or grandmothers,

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and they tell me, of course I can't talk to the mothers,

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unfortunately that they're longer alive.

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Um, but they tell me that their mother told them,

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and they can sometimes remember this,

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that they would be spat up in the street.

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They would be slapped,

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they'd have abusive things thrown at them, you know, your,

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the n word, harlet or whatever, you know.

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So there were all these, abuse.

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Um, and also it was very difficult for them to

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get childcare, for, a mixed race child.

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Um, so I mean, they were up against all those problems

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and to get work if they needed to take the child with them.

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And they were, I mean, some of the mothers were thrown out

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by their families.

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'cause these are young women often living at home.

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And, and the families wouldn't have it.

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I mean, some did, as I said.

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And sometimes the grandmothers were, were terrific

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and would step in Some grandmothers,

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however, really were

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less than helpful in that when letters arrived from the

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swell boyfriend who'd gone back

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to the states, they would destroy them.

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I mean, I've heard stories that they found out later

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that, you know, she had destroyed.

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She didn't want further contact.

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And, but you know, many, many stepped in.

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So I think it was very difficult for the mothers.

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And presumably the grandmothers,

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sometimes the grandmother would be thought to be

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by the child, thought to be their mother, you know,

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especially if you're relatively young, 40 or whatever.

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Um, and I mean, that's obviously not just true

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of these mixed race children.

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You, you hear these stories where a grandmother comes in

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and takes over and passes it off as her own child.

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Um, but,

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but I think the children themselves had a,

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a pretty difficult time 'cause they were growing

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and growing up in what were predominantly very white

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areas, geographical areas.

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And many of them didn't see anyone like themselves.

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They had no role models. They were name called.

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And quite a few of them said they didn't know

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what these names meant.

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And so one tells me how she came back to her mother

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and said, they're calling me Blackie.

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And, and the mother said, just go and call 'em Whitey.

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And she sort of thought, well, it

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doesn't really have the same.

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And, but I mean, some of them didn't really even recognize

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that they were, they knew they were different,

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but they didn't even,

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before they were teenagers,

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really recognize in what way they were different.

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It's very interesting. And then they would,

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then they would get suddenly that recognition.

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I mean, there's one who was in a children's home

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when she was about 14.

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She looked in the mirror and she suddenly

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noticed she was black.

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I mean, extraordinary.

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And she said, why didn't you tell me I was black?

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I mean, you know, it is bizarre.

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'cause we now think surely everyone would've known. But

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Actually children don't necessarily see in those terms.

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But I think the fact that they felt,

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they didn't really belong, they didn't have fathers.

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I mean, one or two had stepfathers who were kind,

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sometimes had stepfathers who were very unkind.

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But there was one, Janet Baker, she, she,

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her stepfather who she thought was her father, was lovely

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and took her as his own.

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And, you know, she later found out when her mother died,

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she found out that she, her grandmother told her, you know,

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actually, he isn't your father.

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And she was terribly upset by that.

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But, but, but many had stepfathers.

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If they had stepfathers, you know, if, if the,

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'cause a lot of these women were married

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and, the, the men would come back in the war

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and a lot of 'em throw the women out.

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But some would say, okay, you can keep the child,

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because I mean, presumably they'd often had relationships

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wherever they'd been, you know,

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and it's the, the nature of, of war.

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But they often were, were quite unkind to them

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because we've also got this online exhibition.

12:59.485 --> 13:00.865
People are coming forward all the time.

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So I have people say, well, I'm one of those,

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or my, my, the next generation down is saying,

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this was my, you know, this AGI was my grandfather

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and I want to find out.

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And so they're now, you know, still looking

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for the American families

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and we send them down the DNA route,

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which is, I I incredible.

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'cause you couldn't find, I mean even, you know,

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even last year, two or three of the people I've interviewed

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and now found families in the states

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that they didn't know before at all.

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So, I want, obviously people who, are part of that,

13:33.745 --> 13:37.505
part is it that being part of their story,

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obviously want, want them to realize they weren't alone.

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But I also want, you know, a wider public to,

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to learn about this because it's such a, I think important

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but lost story of, of the war

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of black British history, et cetera.

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And although it doesn't sound like big numbers,

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although I think there's more than 2000,

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it was quite a significant relative to the overall numbers

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of black people in the country as a whole.

14:04.445 --> 14:06.745
So, you know, and they're all in these little pockets

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around, around the country growing up,

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thinking they're the only one.

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And you know, now they're through the book,

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at my book launch, and then there's a,

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a Facebook group and other things.

14:18.755 --> 14:20.945
We've set up meetings and they're now, you know,

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meeting each other and they feel it's so transformative,

14:24.205 --> 14:28.645
the recognition that they are not on their own, their,

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their experiences were kind

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of held by all these other people.

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And I think that's really enriching. I.

00:00 - I was watching a program called Mixed Britannia, which is about the, the whole, the, the mixed race nature of Britain through the 20th century. And I was watching the second, I'd actually been involved a little bit in the first episode, but the second episode opened with the,

00:21 - presenter, George Alleg going off to meet his brother-in-Law, who was, someone born to a black gi and a white British woman had been given up to Bernardos. And then there's another person in the home also had gone to, sorry, in the program and also gone to a children's home. And I thought, this is so fascinating. I didn't know about these children at all. And at the time, I was working on something else,

00:47 - I was working on, women in the 1920s. So I thought, I'll go back to this and see if anyone has written about this. And, you know, and I went back in two years later, 2013, there was very, very little written, and I thought it'd be great to actually talk to these people themselves. It was estimated about 2000. And so I went on the radio, I put adverts in local papers, various ways of, of trying to find people.

01:15 - And it all snowballed. And then I, I started the interviews and it absolutely fascinating. And still people are coming forward. I mean, I think there were more than two, 2000 actually. I think there were more than two thou. It's just, there seems to be so many, and the, the story, there's so little known that these children were born. I just think it's, it's a part of, British history,

01:35 - a part of the history of the war that people just don't generally know about. So the term brown baby sounds a bit strange, but it's the term coined by the African American press. just after the war, I think it was the Pittsburgh Courier, which was a leading, black American newspaper, and they called them the brown babies in this country. They were called half Cast, which is a really unpleasant term,

02:02 - or they were called colored. But brown babies was the term that the African American press used. And a lot of the people I've interviewed actually like the term as a way of describing a particular grouping of, of, of that time. And it wasn't of course, just in Britain because Americans, you know, went all over the place. But after the war when they occupied Germany

02:27 - and Austria, there were children born there to black gis. And a number of them actually were adopted in the States, and they were known as brown babies. So that term, really took off from the African American press. The black gis weren't allowed to marry because they, every, every GI had to get permission to marry from their commanding officer. And invariably, the commanding officers were white. And again, invariably they would refuse.

02:56 - And if they were pressed for a reason, They'd say, well, back in the States were then 40 states of those 30 had anti miscegenation laws. Laws that forbade marriage between whites and blacks. So all the southern states. And it's estimated that 75% of the gis, white and black came from the south. So, you know, if they'd gone back. And in fact, I know of a case where a woman did go over in 1947,

03:24 - and married her black gi and she was then deported and he was in prison. So that was a southern state. So it was just not allowed. And you might know that, you know, those anti assassination laws carried on right up until 1967 when at a federal level they were overturned. But there still were 16 states that had these laws. First of all, as I was saying, I try to find people to interview. So, I went on something called Gira,

03:53 - which is a self-help organization that helps people trace their GI families. I went on radio, local radio, national radio, some women's art, et cetera. And, I also went to various archives. So I went to the archives all over the place. So I mean, obviously the National Archives with Auto Archives in Somerset. And there, I mean, there were various archives to find out about the various children's homes

04:23 - to find out about, any other information. So about, about, about the children and about attitudes towards the black gi. So the National Archives has a lot on that. I mean, very racist attitudes. The, British War Cabinet didn't want any black GIS to come over a tour. but the thing is, Roosevelt had made a deal with the black leaders in 1940. He got reelected in 1940,

04:51 - and he, he, said that he, he agreed to the military to represent the percentage of black Americans in the country, which is 10%. So he did say that anywhere they went in the theater of war, they should be up to, you know, about 10% of them, should be, black gis. And of course, it was a segregated army. It went on being segregated officially to 1948. But actually, apparently it carried on even in the Korea war, there was that segregation.

05:24 - So, that's why they did come. And, and, you know, they, they came, they joined after Pearl Harbor in December 41, and they started arriving in January 42. And there's all this, comings and goings between the war cam and, people in the states saying, look, if you can't, stop and coming, you know, they then talked about, we want to make sure they don't have any contact with white British women.

05:53 - And, so, Morrison Home secretary says, you know, it would be a great, it'll be a great problem if we have a, a whole growth of half cast children. So there's this notion that Britain is fundamentally white and we don't really want these people here. We got to come, we got to keep them away. And there are these directives of written about how, women should have as little to do, with the black jazz as possible.

06:20 - These are handed out to, the women in the Army, but there is that general kind of disapproval. But of course, actually, you know, women on the whole take no notice of this. And there are these dances that get set up. some nights are called white dances. Some are called black dances because there is this anxiety that, the white gis are going to be very hostile as they indeed were to seeing black gis with white women.

06:49 - And in fact, I mean, they were so abusive and they did the most terrible things. And I, I mean, I, there's, there's definitely evidence that kind of lynched men and, you know, horrendous stuff that got covered up. But to try and minimize this, a lot of villages and towns were designated for blacks only, or they just give the name of, of the actual unit one one day, and one evening, and, and whites the next, and similarly pubs.

07:13 - So you had that segregation, and for dances, you'd have the black dancers where, you know, women could meet the black gis. and indeed they would have pubs where they could go and meet them. So they, they did meet them. although they, you know, often had a lot of hostility from the white eyes. The women were spat out as well as the black eyes being, being, abused.

07:36 - but you know, they were, they were seen as attractive. They were kind of seen exotic. Many people hadn't seen many black people unless you lived in the port of Liverpool, a very, or, or Cardiff or Bristol. I mean, it was, it was a, a very, very white country. Then. There was only about eight to 10,000, people of color across the whole country. but also they often ha came with new dances, Lindy Hop, et cetera.

08:04 - and music, they often came with jazz bands. And, you know, women loved dancing. This was like the biggest leisure pursuit for women across class, dancing and going to the pictures, which was cheap then. And so, you know, it, they, this is seen as very attractive. Here were these men who you hadn't seen that name before, but also they, they were, knew how to dance. They had this amazing music. So inevitably relationships formed.

08:33 - And inevitably also babies appeared because, you know, I don't think any birth control was used. I know that GIS would've been handed condoms, but did they use them? I doubt it. And you know, people lived had this idea that you dunno what's gonna happen tomorrow. You have to live for the moment. And so I think that was the last thing on their minds. Really, nearly half of these children, well, No, just over half of the children were kept

08:57 - by mothers or grandmothers. Sometimes it was grandmothers and the mothers aren't quite young. And you know, the grandmother felt, well, I'll step in the, and the others, it's pro, approximately about 50 50 were put in children's homes. So those that were kept by mothers or grandmothers, and they tell me, of course I can't talk to the mothers, unfortunately that they're longer alive. but they tell me that their mother told them,

09:22 - and they can sometimes remember this, that they would be spat up in the street. They would be slapped, they'd have abusive things thrown at them, you know, your, the n word, harlet or whatever, you know. So there were all these, abuse. and also it was very difficult for them to get childcare, for, a mixed race child. so I mean, they were up against all those problems and to get work if they needed to take the child with them.

09:52 - And they were, I mean, some of the mothers were thrown out by their families. 'cause these are young women often living at home. And, and the families wouldn't have it. I mean, some did, as I said. And sometimes the grandmothers were, were terrific and would step in Some grandmothers, however, really were less than helpful in that when letters arrived from the swell boyfriend who'd gone back

10:18 - to the states, they would destroy them. I mean, I've heard stories that they found out later that, you know, she had destroyed. She didn't want further contact. And, but you know, many, many stepped in. So I think it was very difficult for the mothers. And presumably the grandmothers, sometimes the grandmother would be thought to be by the child, thought to be their mother, you know, especially if you're relatively young, 40 or whatever.

10:41 - and I mean, that's obviously not just true of these mixed race children. You, you hear these stories where a grandmother comes in and takes over and passes it off as her own child. but, but I think the children themselves had a, a pretty difficult time 'cause they were growing and growing up in what were predominantly very white areas, geographical areas. And many of them didn't see anyone like themselves.

11:04 - They had no role models. They were name called. And quite a few of them said they didn't know what these names meant. And so one tells me how she came back to her mother and said, they're calling me Blackie. And, and the mother said, just go and call 'em Whitey. And she sort of thought, well, it doesn't really have the same. And, but I mean, some of them didn't really even recognize that they were, they knew they were different,

11:28 - but they didn't even, before they were teenagers, really recognize in what way they were different. It's very interesting. And then they would, then they would get suddenly that recognition. I mean, there's one who was in a children's home when she was about 14. She looked in the mirror and she suddenly noticed she was black. I mean, extraordinary.

11:46 - And she said, why didn't you tell me I was black? I mean, you know, it is bizarre. 'cause we now think surely everyone would've known. But Actually children don't necessarily see in those terms. But I think the fact that they felt, they didn't really belong, they didn't have fathers. I mean, one or two had stepfathers who were kind, sometimes had stepfathers who were very unkind. But there was one, Janet Baker, she, she, her stepfather who she thought was her father, was lovely

12:16 - and took her as his own. And, you know, she later found out when her mother died, she found out that she, her grandmother told her, you know, actually, he isn't your father. And she was terribly upset by that. But, but, but many had stepfathers. If they had stepfathers, you know, if, if the, 'cause a lot of these women were married and, the, the men would come back in the war and a lot of 'em throw the women out.

12:43 - But some would say, okay, you can keep the child, because I mean, presumably they'd often had relationships wherever they'd been, you know, and it's the, the nature of, of war. But they often were, were quite unkind to them because we've also got this online exhibition. People are coming forward all the time. So I have people say, well, I'm one of those, or my, my, the next generation down is saying, this was my, you know, this AGI was my grandfather

13:10 - and I want to find out. And so they're now, you know, still looking for the American families and we send them down the DNA route, which is, I I incredible. 'cause you couldn't find, I mean even, you know, even last year, two or three of the people I've interviewed and now found families in the states that they didn't know before at all. So, I want, obviously people who, are part of that,

13:33 - part is it that being part of their story, obviously want, want them to realize they weren't alone. But I also want, you know, a wider public to, to learn about this because it's such a, I think important but lost story of, of the war of black British history, et cetera. And although it doesn't sound like big numbers, although I think there's more than 2000, it was quite a significant relative to the overall numbers of black people in the country as a whole.

14:04 - So, you know, and they're all in these little pockets around, around the country growing up, thinking they're the only one. And you know, now they're through the book, at my book launch, and then there's a, a Facebook group and other things. We've set up meetings and they're now, you know, meeting each other and they feel it's so transformative, the recognition that they are not on their own, their, their experiences were kind

14:30 - of held by all these other people. And I think that's really enriching. I.

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