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What the Heart Wants: Polyamory, Compersion and Monogamish Arrangements

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Mary Andres prepares clinicians to work with clients considering or in consensual non-monogamous or polyamorous relationships.

Image courtesy of interviewee. May 3, 2024

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This video video is a transcript of a discussion led by a clinical psychologist and professor who has been working for over 30 years in therapy and training marriage and family therapists. The speaker addresses the growing visibility of consensual non-monogamy (CNM) and polyamory in therapeutic settings. They emphasize the importance of understanding diverse relationship dynamics, including the capacity for compersion—a feeling of joy that comes from a partner’s happiness with someone else.

The speaker highlights the stigma surrounding CNM, noting that many therapists and their clients may have limited exposure or preconceived notions about non-monogamous relationships. This video video can lead to issues of judgment and misunderstanding within clinical practice. They stress the need for therapists to engage in self-reflection and to cultivate open, non-judgmental attitudes to facilitate better understanding and support for clients exploring these relationship styles.

The discussion also touches upon cultural humility and the need for continuous education in understanding different relationship configurations, noting that societal views on relationships are evolving, much like those regarding interracial relationships or single-parent families. Ultimately, the speaker encourages clinicians to foster a safe, inclusive environment for clients to discuss their relationship dynamics and to learn from their experiences, aiming for a more accepting future for all kinds of relationships.

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I wrote this chapter because I have two primary roles.

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One is that I am a clinical psychologist

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and I provide therapy to a lot

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of different adults in relationships, both individually

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and with their partners that come into sessions.

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Um, so I'm gonna be talking about polyamory, consensual,

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non-monogamy, and CNM interchangeably.

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Uh, as I go through this conversation with you,

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the second role that I have is

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that I'm a professor in a marriage of, in a Master's

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of Science program, and I'm training marriage

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and family therapists

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to do therapy from a sex positive social justice lens.

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I've been doing this for more than 30 years,

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and as I've been doing this work,

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consensual non-monogamy has become more visible

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and more people are discussing it with their therapists.

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So I wanted to be optimally prepared,

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and I want this next generation of therapists

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to contemplate these configurations first in the academic

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setting before they, have a couple

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or, some configuration of individuals

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or more people sitting in front of them

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and then them figuring it out, you know,

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on the fly at that point.

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So some students have not knowingly had an L-G-B-T-Q

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or any non-binary person in their

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lives until graduate school.

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Um, more than that, have not knowingly had anyone in their

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lives who's been in any kind of an ethical non-monogamous

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or polyamorous relationship.

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And what happens oftentimes when I'm in class is when I

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bring up this idea, people go, I just can't imagine.

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And they really just think their first response is,

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I would be so jealous,

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or I would feel so many insecurities come up about not being

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enough, couldn't handle it.

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So this idea of compersion

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that I write about is not a new idea to me.

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It's been around for a long time.

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It's this idea that feels like a foreign concept,

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but it's that the feeling of joy

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or happiness one has when their partner is experiencing

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happiness with another,

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they delight in their partner's fulfillment.

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There may be some jealousy or insecurity alongside that,

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but sometimes compersion actually will eclipse those

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feelings and the person's truly completely pleased

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that their partner's good,

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and then that partner returns grateful,

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and there's a generosity of spirit

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that happens between them.

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So the idea of poly means many and amory means love.

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So polyamory means that we love more than one person.

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We all do that. We all have families, friends, kids,

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communities, and we have our different needs get met in

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different ways through our various relationships.

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When we're talking about polyamorous relationships, though,

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the inference is that there's also sexual expression

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and connection with others.

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Some partners might be primary, to one another,

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and they might be dating each dating someone else,

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or a couple might be dating another

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Couple.

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And if they do that, they might promise what's called poly

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fidelity to each other.

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And that means an agreement about the sexual

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behavior staying within that foursome.

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But these agreements themselves are living contracts,

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you know, and they get negotiated along the way.

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People who are practicing CNM are great communicators

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because they're being explicit

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and current about so many aspects of their relationship

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that a lot of other adults have never considered

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or ever openly discussed.

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Even though there might be a greater awareness

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of consensual non-monogamy,

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there's still a huge stigma about

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breaking the monogamy rules.

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Participants are thriving with the benefits of doing this

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because they're feeling the ones

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that are in this community are, are participating in CNM.

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They, they're reporting benefits

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of an increased sense of desirability.

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Uh, they feel the endorphins of new relationship

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and new relationship energy.

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Uh, they're infatuated,

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they're having new experiencing experiences,

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they're planning for new dates and things like that.

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They're, they're embracing more love

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and they're feeling like they're living congruently

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with a sexual identity and sexual behavior.

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And that is a kind of self-care, that authenticity.

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So they're maintaining their relationship the

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way they're defining it.

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And that might not look the same as how a clinician's life

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and relationships might look.

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Many in our culture are quick to call this cheating,

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and without knowing that the rules have been rewritten

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within the relationship, friends, families,

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and clinicians have had really strong judgements.

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So this can lead to a strain for the participants,

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for somebody who already has a minoritized identity.

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So somebody who might identify as queer

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or person of color, this is just another way

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of them feeling othered.

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Then there are people who have never been marginalized in

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any way, and this might be the first time

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that they have a secret.

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Like it could be like a young person having a crush on

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someone with the same gender

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and they're so excited, you know about it.

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Or sometimes we have widowers or something

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and they're falling in love,

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but they're afraid to tell their own children about it

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because they don't wanna be judged.

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It's so difficult to be excited about infatuation or love

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and to feel like you have to keep it a secret from those

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that are closest to you.

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And that's how this experience of being in a CNM kind

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of identity or relationship is part

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of the outsider experience known as minority stress.

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So I wrote this chapter so that clinicians, primarily

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for clinicians, it's in a social work, book handbook,

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was, that they could engage in self-reflection about

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what our attitudes

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and beliefs are about relationships in fidelity.

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Because countertransference are the feelings

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that a therapist will have when we're working with a client.

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And these feelings that come up, they can be favorable.

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It's like, we're so much alike.

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Or they can be, feel because of familiarity,

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or they can be unfavorable more like judgments

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or fears, you know?

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And, if we don't know what our stuff is, then

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what we do is we inadvertently might be pushing our

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agenda onto our clients.

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Um, I present scenarios, in the chapter

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with various kinds of situations so clinicians can see

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that what's happening in our own lives might shape our

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perceptions, leading us to respond with an unconscious,

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with an unconscious start over again.

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I present scenarios to help clinicians see

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that whatever is happening in our own lives

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may shape our perceptions, leading us to respond

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with unconscious bias or unintended microaggressions.

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As a sex positive therapist, I want my language

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to invite openness

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and I want to use inclusive language beginning from my

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intake paperwork,

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and in the language I use

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to honor their client's intersexual and identities

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and their relationships throughout our relationship.

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So one example that I think about is that a kind

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of transfer is I had a student once

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and she had been seeing a therapist for quite a while,

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and she was having her very first romantic relationship.

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And the therapist said, you're not having sex, are you?

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That's how the therapist spoke to the client.

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The client continued to see that same young man,

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not the client, my student, her client, continued to see

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that same young man, but she never talked about the

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relationship again.

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And part that's kind of an important part of someone's life,

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but that's what transference feels like.

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What had happened in their relationship

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or countertransference is that the therapist had known her

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for a while and had like a maternal transference toward,

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towards this young woman.

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And, but the message she gives is what's okay

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and what's not okay to talk about.

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And I want us as clinicians to have that attitude

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of say anything like, this is a non-judgmental, safe space.

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Talk about whatever you need to talk about in here.

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To be a practitioner in the field of psychotherapy means

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that we're cultural brokers who need to stay connected

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to the changing dynamics

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and trends that are both the delights

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and the stressors impacting the communities we work in.

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We all have our own origin stories,

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and we engage in a reflective practice.

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We contemplate our actions in the process

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of continuous learning.

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We notice what beliefs serve us, and we acknowledge

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and support that what works

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for us might be something completely

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different for somebody else.

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Cultural humility honors that plurality

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that there is not just one preferred way of being,

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but that each person can choose their own path.

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Yes, to work with relationships, we need to maintain an open

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and curious posture.

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We convey empathy by accurately reflecting

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how we understand our client's worldview.

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We join with them to consult

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and we see through their eyes noticing

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what might feel unfamiliar to us.

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And then we take ownership to learn more about those areas.

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We attend our own affective responses, meaning any kind

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of strong feelings or opinions

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that are getting activated in us,

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and we're curious about what we don't yet know.

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So we explore further.

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We reference training

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and literature like the handbook of CNM,

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affirming mental health practice.

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And we deepen our understanding.

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We take responsibility to learn

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and know about these communities

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and these experiences instead

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of us putting the burden on our clients

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to be the ones teaching us.

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Part of what makes a good therapist is open-minded,

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non-judgmental attitudes.

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And so the thing is, is that,

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and I think that there is a component

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of self-forgiveness involved.

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You know, that we don't know it all,

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that we aren't going to be perfect.

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We are going to have areas of our own life

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that don't feel finished, that don't feel okay for us.

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So we commit to working on our own stuff first so

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that we can be as clear of a channel

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to be helpful to other people.

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There are lots and lots of times where I'm very clear

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that I would not be making the same lifestyle choices

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that my clients are making.

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You know, whether they're working themselves to death

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and they feel like, I've gotta do this, you know,

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and then I wanna retire at 45.

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And I'm like, okay, that looks ambitiously lovely,

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but man, I can tell how stressed you are.

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And then there, you know, there's, there's a lot

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of different ways that we recognize our separateness from

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our clients and we respect them, you know, in terms of like

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the, their right of decision to decide

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what they wanna do in their own lives.

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So, continuing to learn and to explore

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and to be open to new cultures and new ideas.

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That's just part of being a lifelong learner.

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And I think that's the onus on anybody

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who enters the mental health field, is

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that there's continuous education mandated for a reason,

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but hopefully that is the kind of education that

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encourages that reflective practice.

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So one of the things about working with poly relationships

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and therapy that's been rewarding for me is that I get

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to see couples realizing these new possibilities

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and exercising a kind of courage and authenticity,

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and they're prioritizing kindness

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and reassurance in their relationships.

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So that work that they're doing, that work

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of being self-aware and speaking their minds

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and talking about what's important to them

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and being attuned to the timing

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and the impact of their words and behaviors

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and their relationships,

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that's actually exactly the same thing.

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I'm trying to teach new therapists.

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You know, I'm trying to teach them to be self-aware,

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to be connected with what's going on,

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to trust their instincts, to speak up, to ask for

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what they need, because we teach what we need to learn,

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you know, so as we're all practicing these kinds

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of best practices, you know, that's what we're passing on.

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And so, I, I want the therapist to be able

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to do that kind of practice

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and to be able to hold that kind

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of safe affirming sex positive space

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for whoever's coming into their office.

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I have a hope for the future safety for all relationships

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that might be ne be less typical.

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Um, and I know that this comes with both time and exposure.

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There was a time that you probably remember when, maybe not,

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but when interracial dating

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or marriage was considered illegal or just very uncommon,

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and there were lots of people that are still around

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that came from divorced families when they were kids,

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and they felt very stigmatized by that.

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Those are considered variances,

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and sometimes they're not even considered at all anymore.

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You know, like that's how normative

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these variances have been in other kinds of situations.

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So, just as teachers now might accommodate

12:59.245 --> 13:01.125
that parents have two separate last names,

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or that there are multiple loving responsible adults in a

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child's life as partners with new people in their lives,

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becomes that there's new people in their lives

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beyond those initial configurations.

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Our language and our attitudes need to expand

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to accommodate the lives that those folks are living.

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So when I think about ethical practice, this includes

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recognizing that all therapeutic relationships

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reflect some kind of a cross-cultural experience.

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Even if we're having multiple intersectional identities

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that are similar to a client sitting with us,

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we still are living our own distinct lives

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and making different choices according

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to our own needs and wants.

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And no matter what our own relational configurations might

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be, past, present, or ideal, we know we need to know

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and accept that about ourselves.

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This is what you were asking me earlier.

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And then we need to do our own work.

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And as we're doing it, then we can offer that safe,

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culturally attuned holding environment for our clients

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to examine their, and, examine

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and live their best lives as they define it.

00:00 - I wrote this chapter because I have two primary roles. One is that I am a clinical psychologist and I provide therapy to a lot of different adults in relationships, both individually and with their partners that come into sessions. so I'm gonna be talking about polyamory, consensual,

00:17 - non-monogamy, and CNM interchangeably. as I go through this conversation with you, the second role that I have is that I'm a professor in a marriage of, in a Master's of Science program, and I'm training marriage and family therapists to do therapy from a sex positive social justice lens. I've been doing this for more than 30 years, and as I've been doing this work, consensual non-monogamy has become more visible

00:44 - and more people are discussing it with their therapists. So I wanted to be optimally prepared, and I want this next generation of therapists to contemplate these configurations first in the academic setting before they, have a couple or, some configuration of individuals or more people sitting in front of them and then them figuring it out, you know, on the fly at that point. So some students have not knowingly had an L-G-B-T-Q

01:12 - or any non-binary person in their lives until graduate school. more than that, have not knowingly had anyone in their lives who's been in any kind of an ethical non-monogamous or polyamorous relationship. And what happens oftentimes when I'm in class is when I bring up this idea, people go, I just can't imagine. And they really just think their first response is, I would be so jealous, or I would feel so many insecurities come up about not being

01:41 - enough, couldn't handle it. So this idea of compersion that I write about is not a new idea to me. It's been around for a long time. It's this idea that feels like a foreign concept, but it's that the feeling of joy or happiness one has when their partner is experiencing happiness with another, they delight in their partner's fulfillment. There may be some jealousy or insecurity alongside that,

02:06 - but sometimes compersion actually will eclipse those feelings and the person's truly completely pleased that their partner's good, and then that partner returns grateful, and there's a generosity of spirit that happens between them. So the idea of poly means many and amory means love. So polyamory means that we love more than one person. We all do that. We all have families, friends, kids, communities, and we have our different needs get met in

02:39 - different ways through our various relationships. When we're talking about polyamorous relationships, though, the inference is that there's also sexual expression and connection with others. Some partners might be primary, to one another, and they might be dating each dating someone else, or a couple might be dating another Couple. And if they do that, they might promise what's called poly fidelity to each other.

03:04 - And that means an agreement about the sexual behavior staying within that foursome. But these agreements themselves are living contracts, you know, and they get negotiated along the way. People who are practicing CNM are great communicators because they're being explicit and current about so many aspects of their relationship that a lot of other adults have never considered or ever openly discussed. Even though there might be a greater awareness

03:36 - of consensual non-monogamy, there's still a huge stigma about breaking the monogamy rules. Participants are thriving with the benefits of doing this because they're feeling the ones that are in this community are, are participating in CNM. They, they're reporting benefits of an increased sense of desirability. they feel the endorphins of new relationship and new relationship energy.

04:01 - they're infatuated, they're having new experiencing experiences, they're planning for new dates and things like that. They're, they're embracing more love and they're feeling like they're living congruently with a sexual identity and sexual behavior. And that is a kind of self-care, that authenticity. So they're maintaining their relationship the way they're defining it. And that might not look the same as how a clinician's life

04:27 - and relationships might look. Many in our culture are quick to call this cheating, and without knowing that the rules have been rewritten within the relationship, friends, families, and clinicians have had really strong judgements. So this can lead to a strain for the participants, for somebody who already has a minoritized identity. So somebody who might identify as queer or person of color, this is just another way of them feeling othered.

04:54 - Then there are people who have never been marginalized in any way, and this might be the first time that they have a secret. Like it could be like a young person having a crush on someone with the same gender and they're so excited, you know about it. Or sometimes we have widowers or something and they're falling in love, but they're afraid to tell their own children about it because they don't wanna be judged.

05:15 - It's so difficult to be excited about infatuation or love and to feel like you have to keep it a secret from those that are closest to you. And that's how this experience of being in a CNM kind of identity or relationship is part of the outsider experience known as minority stress. So I wrote this chapter so that clinicians, primarily for clinicians, it's in a social work, book handbook, was, that they could engage in self-reflection about what our attitudes

05:47 - and beliefs are about relationships in fidelity. Because countertransference are the feelings that a therapist will have when we're working with a client. And these feelings that come up, they can be favorable. It's like, we're so much alike. Or they can be, feel because of familiarity, or they can be unfavorable more like judgments or fears, you know? And, if we don't know what our stuff is, then what we do is we inadvertently might be pushing our

06:16 - agenda onto our clients. I present scenarios, in the chapter with various kinds of situations so clinicians can see that what's happening in our own lives might shape our perceptions, leading us to respond with an unconscious, with an unconscious start over again. I present scenarios to help clinicians see that whatever is happening in our own lives may shape our perceptions, leading us to respond with unconscious bias or unintended microaggressions.

06:50 - As a sex positive therapist, I want my language to invite openness and I want to use inclusive language beginning from my intake paperwork, and in the language I use to honor their client's intersexual and identities and their relationships throughout our relationship. So one example that I think about is that a kind of transfer is I had a student once and she had been seeing a therapist for quite a while,

07:19 - and she was having her very first romantic relationship. And the therapist said, you're not having sex, are you? That's how the therapist spoke to the client. The client continued to see that same young man, not the client, my student, her client, continued to see that same young man, but she never talked about the relationship again. And part that's kind of an important part of someone's life, but that's what transference feels like. What had happened in their relationship

07:46 - or countertransference is that the therapist had known her for a while and had like a maternal transference toward, towards this young woman. And, but the message she gives is what's okay and what's not okay to talk about. And I want us as clinicians to have that attitude of say anything like, this is a non-judgmental, safe space. Talk about whatever you need to talk about in here. To be a practitioner in the field of psychotherapy means that we're cultural brokers who need to stay connected

08:16 - to the changing dynamics and trends that are both the delights and the stressors impacting the communities we work in. We all have our own origin stories, and we engage in a reflective practice. We contemplate our actions in the process of continuous learning. We notice what beliefs serve us, and we acknowledge and support that what works for us might be something completely

08:38 - different for somebody else. Cultural humility honors that plurality that there is not just one preferred way of being, but that each person can choose their own path. Yes, to work with relationships, we need to maintain an open and curious posture. We convey empathy by accurately reflecting how we understand our client's worldview. We join with them to consult and we see through their eyes noticing

09:06 - what might feel unfamiliar to us. And then we take ownership to learn more about those areas. We attend our own affective responses, meaning any kind of strong feelings or opinions that are getting activated in us, and we're curious about what we don't yet know. So we explore further. We reference training and literature like the handbook of CNM, affirming mental health practice.

09:30 - And we deepen our understanding. We take responsibility to learn and know about these communities and these experiences instead of us putting the burden on our clients to be the ones teaching us. Part of what makes a good therapist is open-minded, non-judgmental attitudes. And so the thing is, is that, and I think that there is a component

09:52 - of self-forgiveness involved. You know, that we don't know it all, that we aren't going to be perfect. We are going to have areas of our own life that don't feel finished, that don't feel okay for us. So we commit to working on our own stuff first so that we can be as clear of a channel to be helpful to other people. There are lots and lots of times where I'm very clear that I would not be making the same lifestyle choices

10:20 - that my clients are making. You know, whether they're working themselves to death and they feel like, I've gotta do this, you know, and then I wanna retire at 45. And I'm like, okay, that looks ambitiously lovely, but man, I can tell how stressed you are. And then there, you know, there's, there's a lot of different ways that we recognize our separateness from our clients and we respect them, you know, in terms of like the, their right of decision to decide

10:47 - what they wanna do in their own lives. So, continuing to learn and to explore and to be open to new cultures and new ideas. That's just part of being a lifelong learner. And I think that's the onus on anybody who enters the mental health field, is that there's continuous education mandated for a reason, but hopefully that is the kind of education that encourages that reflective practice. So one of the things about working with poly relationships

11:16 - and therapy that's been rewarding for me is that I get to see couples realizing these new possibilities and exercising a kind of courage and authenticity, and they're prioritizing kindness and reassurance in their relationships. So that work that they're doing, that work of being self-aware and speaking their minds and talking about what's important to them and being attuned to the timing and the impact of their words and behaviors

11:40 - and their relationships, that's actually exactly the same thing. I'm trying to teach new therapists. You know, I'm trying to teach them to be self-aware, to be connected with what's going on, to trust their instincts, to speak up, to ask for what they need, because we teach what we need to learn, you know, so as we're all practicing these kinds of best practices, you know, that's what we're passing on. And so, I, I want the therapist to be able

12:08 - to do that kind of practice and to be able to hold that kind of safe affirming sex positive space for whoever's coming into their office. I have a hope for the future safety for all relationships that might be ne be less typical. and I know that this comes with both time and exposure. There was a time that you probably remember when, maybe not, but when interracial dating or marriage was considered illegal or just very uncommon,

12:36 - and there were lots of people that are still around that came from divorced families when they were kids, and they felt very stigmatized by that. Those are considered variances, and sometimes they're not even considered at all anymore. You know, like that's how normative these variances have been in other kinds of situations. So, just as teachers now might accommodate that parents have two separate last names, or that there are multiple loving responsible adults in a

13:04 - child's life as partners with new people in their lives, becomes that there's new people in their lives beyond those initial configurations. Our language and our attitudes need to expand to accommodate the lives that those folks are living. So when I think about ethical practice, this includes recognizing that all therapeutic relationships reflect some kind of a cross-cultural experience. Even if we're having multiple intersectional identities that are similar to a client sitting with us,

13:37 - we still are living our own distinct lives and making different choices according to our own needs and wants. And no matter what our own relational configurations might be, past, present, or ideal, we know we need to know and accept that about ourselves. This is what you were asking me earlier. And then we need to do our own work. And as we're doing it, then we can offer that safe, culturally attuned holding environment for our clients

14:04 - to examine their, and, examine and live their best lives as they define it.

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